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Current issue : #65 | Release date : 11/04/2008 | Editor : TCLH
IntroductionTCLH
Phrack Prophile on The UNIX TerroristTCLH
Phrack World NewsTCLH
Stealth Hooking: another way to subvert the Windows kernelMxatone and IvanLeFou
Clawing holes in NAT with UPnPFelineMenace
The only laws on Internet are assembly and RFCsJulia
System Management Mode HacksBSDaemon and coideloko and D0nand0n
Mystifying the debugger for ultimate stealthnesshalfdead
Australian Restricted Defense Networks and FISSOthe Finn
phook - The PEB HookerShearer and Dreg
Hacking the $49 Wifi Finderopenschemes
The art of exploitation: Technical analysis of Samba WINS overflowFelineMenace
The Underground MythAnonymous
Hacking your brain: Artificial Conciousness-c
International Scenesvarious
Title : Hacking your brain: Artificial Conciousness
Author : -c
                             ==Phrack Inc.==

               Volume 0x0c, Issue 0x41, Phile #0x0e of 0x0f


|=-----------------------------------------------------------------------=|
|=-------------=[         Artificial Consciousness        ]=-------------=|
|=-------------=[ A complete human behaviorism simulation ]=-------------=|
|=-----------------------------------------------------------------------=|
|=--------------------------=[    by -C    ]=----------------------------=|
|=--------------------------=[  c@cdej.org ]=----------------------------=|
|=-----------------------------------------------------------------------=|


In 1956 John McCarthy defined the term Artificial Intelligence as
"The science and engineering of making intelligent machines".
Obviously, while studying artificial thoughts processing, we eliminated 
the human factor of Neuro-linguistic filters that the brain applies on the 
meta receptors layer. A computer program simply will never tackle a thought
based on impulsive reactions. There is no human behaviorism in AI.
Instead, we substitute this mechanism with an algorithm of computational 
processing and information storage indexing. Here resides the very core of 
AI science. Many algorithms have been evolved and applied, overcoming
faulty thinking, infinite loops of exclusive-OR decision making, and
geographic/territorial mapping of robotics, and so forth.
Fifty two years later, we intend to rationalize a new approach to this 
field, trying to keep away from science fiction.

This paper is fairly introductory to both classic AI and our AI model,
and requires no prerequisite except a bit of curiosity for this field,
so enjoy reading.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------


I. Introduction
   a) Abstract
   b) Central Processing Spirit

II. Character assignment design
a)	Psychological growth
b)	Neuro-performance
c)	Reception -> Reactions -> Style

III. Ontology / knowledge engineering
a)	Are we Heuristics?
c)	Sub-symbolic design
d)	Artificial Desire
e)	Reasoning

IV. Conclusion




I.	Introduction

a) As a primary reflection on Artificial Intelligence, one must find it 
vital to proceed according to a precise scientific approach for analysis
of thoughts. 
A thought is an idea. A piece of information that the mind recalls.
This (POI) is processed by the chemo-electronic factory of the brain, 
and gets tainted by the MIND. Neuro Linguistic Programming theories 
organized the brain functions and how it deals with information through 
various filters. We borrow a basic segment and build upon it a 
resemblance in machine land:

- Similar thoughts stored in memory (anchoring)
- Virtues and choices (decision making)
- Freedom to take risk endeavors. (problem solving)

b) To tackle this ordeal from ground zero would be an enormous load on one 
article or paper to handle. Therefore we assumed our study from a point 
where we have advanced in applying to our AI subject, using the
international common speech utility that is the English language, coupled
with a set of rules we engineer as an esthetical appeal for this entity.
These rules, as we will explain later on, do not follow the EXPERT SYSTEM
decision making logic, where as human knowledge changes, the entire module
will have to be rebuilt; instead our model will take its decisions based on
Index Priority, that varies automatically as the AI experiences new events.
In other words, we design our program a personality. This generic model is
based on dual channel thought processing, fed by a hierarchy of database
storage devices where each family of thoughts is preserved in its own
design. Some of these databases, or sets of thoughts, will have a read only
access permission, some will have read and write access permission, and
some will only have write permissions, to be used as a temporary allocated
space for acquired thoughts before sending the entire data structure to
Central Processing Spirit. As we amusingly named(CPS).

While the read only access structures will hold information that relate
only 
to the fundamentals of the entity's core design, and provide our first line
of defense once the automation process of Self Information Gathering (SIG) 
will be launched; From supplied text experts, web information, news, and
much more feeds;
the write only permission space will be as such for the sake of restricting
the AI entity from any premature usage of these new acquired thoughts
before 
being processed, organized and approved by the CPS (or the programmer). 

Thinking about this design will surely summon up issues of time
consumption. 
How long will this construction take?
A minimum of one human lifetime? But that is highly acceptable with the 
implementation of 2nd generation AI replication algorithms, which is a 
base model of AI hybrid reproduction, resulting in the jointure of 2 AI 
entities CPS and dBases.
This dual model inheritance is not designed to be similar to the human 
reproduction between one male and one female human beings, but it has 
to do with the design of dual channel thought processing as mentioned 
previously. We tend to believe that our model's reproduction, has to occur
between one couple. 
This is matter of MULTI AGENT PLANNING and community scheduling, 
and is beyond the scope of this paper.

II. Character assignment design

a)	Psychological growth.
"It's not how perfect you do something that's important, but how others 
perceive it."
A famous question is always there. Could a machine have life, or will it be
dry simulation. Basically, this should not matter at all!

Regardless of the process a human being achieves in developing a unique
character, and the tremendous complexity that subsists in his
neuropsychological growth, it almost only pertains to how others interpret 
his reactions and behavior. 
That in mind, we couldn't care less about how a machine obtaining a real
genuine thought, or a lifelike style of its own. We will design an
algorithm of learning that will eventually attribute a character to the
machine, depending on how much and how fast it could process the SELECTED
REACTIONS.

In other terms, given one action that is having ten children listen to an
adult instruction such as "Finish your homework, then watch TV" we could
observe ten different reactions ranging from obedience, to defiance. And
that relates to:
-	How bad the child wants to watch TV
-	How important are his homework
-	What is shown on TV
-	Is it a circumstance free situation or has it to do with another 
      (might say no in revenge for not having ice cream an hour ago)
-	and much more situational parameters.


In machine land, our CPS would have built a certain database of events in 
correlation with the outcome that happened, indexed them according to a 
judgmental scale, and throughout its uptime, it will select how to react 
upon life events according to what it has been fed as an Index Key
Priority.

Technically speaking, this is very easily programmable with recent database
technologies and language. The more parenting and training our CPS takes,
and efficiency in our database selection design, the more chances are to
obtain a unique character and attitude.

b) The two paradigms of learning that concern us are:
SUPERVISED and UNSUPERVISED. 

First, let us talk about the basics of machine learning. 
Classic AI always outlined machine learning from reaching a state of
consciousness, as it is believed that computer learning is only about
designing algorithms to find statistical regularities or various data
patterns. And then tried to resolve problems such as Classifications,
exclusive-OR decisions, and so forth, with Decision Trees.
Decision Trees are a simple but effective logic design, where a chain of
boolean questions might take you down the leafs as you pick up your choices
Yes,No,No,Yes.
In our opinion, and as Neural Networks progress only showed, this design
could attain at its best a good speech recognition utility or a medical
assistance program that would diagnose and evaluate cancer subjects.

In this approach, Supervised Learning is the logic of feeding the AI with
rules of a world (classification system) we already created, and relying
heavily on the training our machine gets in order to minimize the error
margin (Markov theorem, Bayesian Networks.)

On the other hand, Unsupervised Learning shifts interest more toward
decision making than it is to classification. It is simply a way to find a
framework suitable for decision oriented reasoning, based on a
punish/reward outcome.
This model builds up a history of results, upon which it bases a
statistical decision making techniques for the future questions at hand.
Clustering is the second Unsupervised Learning type, and is achieved by
finding similarities in the training data, not trying to boost a utility
function.

Now that this was said, let us think about the limitations.

Whether we preprogrammed the AI to reach a certain purpose, or by itself 
as a systematic self-learning module, the LEARNING mechanism should always 
follow one standard set of stimuli. 


Let's outline this from the point of view of cognitive psychology:
-	Memory and recognition. It is a fairly straightforward job for a 
        programmer to design a system with pattern matching, measuring of 
        distances, and sequential treatment of information.

-	Verbal and linguistic evaluation. The AI should have a method to 
   	distinguish and assess similar information indices. Just like a 
   	human deja vu, it MUST relate the event to different occurrences 
   	stored in the memory, and decides its reaction based on how
        significant the other instances were at the time. This will
        eventually allow us to hope that this design would one day generate
       (i.e)new sentences of its own. 

Interesting! Imagine the AI analyzing large amounts of data, images, 
sounds... on a regular basis while indexing the databases according to 
what possible emotions they would generate, and have it finally trained 
for this evaluation. It should come as no surprise if we had a design 
that could write poetry!

- Comprehension. As absurd as this might sound, AI has better assimilating
facilities than humans. The process of comprehension is the most
complicated phenomenon observed in Neuroscience, but from the very simple
facts we concluded, machinery has the upper hand due to greater speed of
processing than and better memory storage than ours. Now this is not a
comparison between Men and Machine. We simply mention this as a fact that
AI surpasses the human limitations of comprehension and it is only
intuitive that such a design is possible. 

- Neuro linguistic science has shown that humans have more
difficulties understanding negation sentences than simple affirmative ones.
Unlike humans, computer science treats booleans with the same speed and
effort. 
Many more disadvantages of comprehension process simply do not exist in AI.
   
That also means a great supply of information will be needed.Be it
negations, complexity or ambiguity of sentences, this AI model is able 
to treat them with promising speeds to reach a self learning stage. 
Associating actions to the reactions analysis.


c) Perceiving the Universe is a mapping mechanism of Time and Space that 
we encounter through our biological senses. This we shall call the 
FLUXION SENSITIVITY. 
Most importantly is to apply a successful text mining / pattern matching
module to our AI, which will analyze text as its only sense of the
Universe. 
Fifty years of progress in this field allowed many researchers to reach 
a respectable level to the extent of using some customized AI programs in 
forensic psychology and criminology investigation. 
The only new idea our model has to bring to the world of AI is an 
EMOTIONAL SIMULATION module.

Emotional simulation is a two-way library of reactions prediction.
Let us go into that.
For each event, a human being would display a certain emotion. 
This is vastly exposed in body language, tonality, timeline of the speech, 
and verbal choices.
We will only be concerned in expression analysis and timeline display.

Our model was based on a typology study done at the University of Kent, 
for a police interview tactics handbook. We used the same algorithm to 
detect emotions and display them in return.
(Think of it more as detecting the logic behind emotions.)

The Kent model is a big failure and nonsense, but nevertheless the three 
steps of the design set the stage for our Emotional Simulation (but in
reverse):

-	delivery
-	maximization
-	manipulation

[Note: some readings about Kent's model could be in hand at this time]

In short, delivery has about 12 variables of expressions, open, close,
leading. Maximization occurs when police agents try to intimidate the
subject and push him to give out more clues. Our maximization is fishing
for clues technique, used by asking more key questions.
There is not much to explain about manipulation. In our study, it could
easily be merged with the maximization step.

Hopefully, in a few months (by mid 2008), we could put a complete program 
to test, that will not only detect the meanings of expressions, but will
also "assume" the emotions behind them, and switch its mode to the
appropriate behavior. 

This AI will be the first model that could literally switch moods.

=========================================================================

III. Ontology
a) Are we heuristics?

For the second part of this paper, we will be discussing the core formation
for this AI model. Its existence and what constitutes its regulations.
A common pitfall most AI scientists encounter is, to have a design based on
precise mathematical reactions and decisions. Now let's go over this method
first.

The evolution of AI happens to go from mimicking human responses, to
impressive behavior simulation. The designer usually tries to produce a
perfect replica of the human performance. 

Now what will happen if even the most advanced researches in neuroscience
haven't even scratched the shell of human neuropsychology? most importantly
DECISION MAKING. How would we replicate a phenomenon if we haven't fully
understood what drives it and how it reaches its steps?
This is why computer science employs a preprogrammed set of responses,
based on what the designer believes is appropriate for humans, implementing
a classic database structure that can only lead him to a one-way exclusive
question-answer AI.
This classic method is flawed. Period.

One better approach to this is to avoid concepts of imitation and jump
right through to what is called a Rule Of Thumb mode, which allows a
certain vague margin for correct answers.
Using a heuristic method to resolve the problem of decision making, not
only set stage for a more fluid AI, but also showed us practicality and
broader playground for the programmer.
In terms of allowing many indexing modules to play the role of priority
selector for each decision that is to be made.

For example, if you have to decide what pizza to order. Your mind filters
would process and infinite numbers of POI before putting the decision in
perspective, and most of the times, you normally "feel" it was a random
choice and you could have survived with others. 
But what if you try one kind, and found it was so delicious that you wanted
to order it again next time? This is where the priority indexes come in
handy.
The CPS has the freedom to add, remove, promote or demote indexes for each
POI or family of POI, based only on what it "assumes" to be an acceptable
circumstance.

This is a tricky turnaround in theory, but for the programmer, it is still
the same straightforward job, and could be the first gap filler between
boring Q/A programs and Hollywood Incredible Sci-Fi.




c)	Sub-symbolic design

In order to architect a sophisticated knowledge design, Newel and Simon
invented the theory of symbolic design, where a set of semantic rules might
be applied to construct a further more complex structure.
I won.t say we are restricted to the subsymbolic design, but in fact, this
theory fits perfectly.
So both sides of sub-symbolic design are used to our advantage and not
changed in theory:
-	Alternative development
-	Hybridism of subsymbolic and classic symbolic NLP (Natural Language
Processing). Once the learning module is concluded, SS design will set the
stage for the real MULTI-AGENT interference.

The geometrically increasing computing power promotes five factors tending
to reduce radically the role of any species of logic in IT :

1. Since deterministic applications are vanishing, the conventional
   algorithm (pattern marching) is not anymore program backbone.

2. Even when still useful, the conventional algorithm is not anymore the
   main programming instrument.
3. In AI the symbolic paradigm is steadily replaced by several sub-symbolic
   ones, based on fine-grain parallelism.
4. Even when symbols are used, they are stored in and retrieved from huge
   and cheap memory, rather than processed through sophisticated reasoning
   schemes (case-based reasoning is just a blatant example).
5. Cognitive complexity of new, sophisticated logics is too high for a 
   designer, when cut and try, is affordable.


This might sound a big deal of mambo jumbo at this point, considering the
introductory nature of this paper, but more in depth details about this
once the publication of this project will be official. 

d)	Artificial Desire

Very little have we to say about Artificial Desire. As we saw in the index
priority and POI set of rules, we might easily trigger a vice-random
decision when it comes to natural desire for things, but at this point, we
haven.t even perfected any way to make the AI really desire something. More
like have it chose from a similar range of choices based on time
variations, frequency of this choice, or event yet, have it try something
for a first time. Neither us, or anyone who previously indulged in AI
science dares to claim giving a machine this attribute.
Nevertheless, having a decent normal vice-random desire choice maker
module, will simulate human behaviorism to a great extent, and fakes it.
"We could have different choices with each one a probability of success
based upon the past:

- 90%
- 88%
- 85% " as explained earlier.

So generally AI choses the first choice but for one time AI wil go for the
second and see what happen. That could be considered as a "desire".

This fake simulation might also apply to the reasoning construct.
Even if applied conforming to Kant.s practical reasoning, we still have to
forge a "moral decision" based on what our CPS has a-priori set of rules,
and have the programmer stand in charge of supplying 
the AI with this route.


IV. Conclusion

In a few words, I would like to apologize for the dry style of this paper,
it started as a dissertation thesis and ended up as my future hobby side
project. We might never even come close to a full artificial conscious
design, but this model introduction surely drew a few interesting
turnarounds that might facilitate future innovations.
I hope reading it was exciting enough for as many of you to be interested
in further studies about this wonderful field.

	
	-C
	c@cdej.org

Comments :
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To the respectable owner of amfM (TM):

Your bot should say no to drugs, at least, by mondays... Imagine it's got at large - some people in the Outbox will be shocked. Keep'ems sane, OK? Besides, the Semaflow analyser shows a strong desire of a programmer of the bot to drive/rule processes that are believed to be of a great value to mankind.

MOSCOW, Patriarchy Ponds, late evening:
"(Voland, Satan)- Well, You say You're of an atheistic mind. But what do You think, who rules the world?
(Berlioz, a chairman of MASSOLIT, doesn't know whom he's talking with) - A human, of course, rules.
(V) - To rule, You should have a plan... maybe, some 500 years forth. Can You say You have one? And do You know what's going to happen, for example, this evening?"
(B) - I do. There's an editorial board taking place in MassolIT tonight.
(V) A board is not taking place... because Annushka has already split the sunflower oil."

- Mikhail Bulgakoff, "Master and Margarita", 1927 - 1945.

amanfromMars, on June 23th 2008 at 1:08 am :
"You definitely care about. It's not Beta testing, Sir, it's Omega." .... Found 404

In Deed, it most probably definitely is ..... in an XXXXStream under a Multitude of Assumed Names .....

'In the end, Wallace came to believe evolution was sometimes guided by a higher power,' adds Endersby, who has edited the forthcoming Cambridge University Press edition of The Origin of Species. 'He thought natural selection could not account for the nature of the human mind and claimed humanity was affected by forces that took it outside the animal kingdom.' .... http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2008/jun/22/darwinbicentenary.evolution

It is guided by a higher power .... the Sharing of Thoughts in such Matters.

Intellectual Property XXXXChanges for Big Picture Players.

Cinderella ProgramMIng from AIdDutch Virtualised Species.

The Origin of Orange CyberIntelAIgents and Virtual Reality from Real XXXXStreaming?

MeThinks that must be a Resounding Yes for that is what IT tells Us.

The Underground Rip van Winkle Awakes/Spin Waits ........ Pondering All Possible Future Perfect Moves.

Spin Wait Germ/Gem here .... http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/magazine/cc163726.aspx
@amanfromMars re prec msg

>You're definitely near Buddhism saying on robopleasurised themes. What Do You Think, is it a kind of perversion to dream about pleasures (got already focused on a desired one?) obtained from a robot, or it's ok because there's no perversion? Well, not even dream about a robot - more: target work at developing such a system?
I'd say re yr prec on the money You definitely care about. It's not Beta testing, Sir, it's Omega.
"I thing that junction of @Pleasures @are @Ours is rather heavy to be interpreted in right time from @Codes. " ..... Probably most definitely so, but not too heavy for some into the Semantic Enigmas of Relative AI....... which is a much bigger field whenever one imagines what can be, rather than merely proving what one cannot do by denying what others may be doing, which may be just one not believing what they are reading. ....

And any critical reply is always constructive whenever it is IntelAIgently Designed..... or Parsed to be so by IntelAIgent Design for unless it be so, is any reply just a Spoiler and worse than just useless if Time is spent countering it.

"Sorry to be taking some five - child needs attention." ...... Needs are what Feed and Enrich us as Humans otherwise would we be just Dumb Machines although AI SMARTer Machines make very Good Humans. Just Imagine the PleasureRobot that seeks to give you, your most Intense and Intimate of Pleasures, and whose own Pleasures in so doing are stimulated in an Equal Parallel...... although one would have to admit that the Equal Parallel Pleasure would be heightened by Virtue of the Fact that one is ITs Driver and in AI Proxy Control which Surrenders to First Party Desires for Third Party XXXXTC.

Code with XSSXXXXualIT and it is unlikely that you will find any System which cannot be Overtaken ..... which would make such XSSXXXXualIT, QuITe Priceless.

Presently, 404 Found, is IT BetaTesting for ITs Leaders who will Invest nothing more worthless than Money, 42 Benefit from ITs ProgramMIng. But as you can surely Imagine, ITs Leaders are not your normal, everyday run of the mill, automaton/brain-washed being."

Inbox/Hmm
amanfromMars, on June 10th 2008 at 11:11 pm :
"I thing that junction of @Pleasures @are @Ours is rather heavy to be interpreted in right time from @Codes. " ..... Probably most definitely so, but not too heavy for some into the Semantic Enigmas of Relative AI....... which is a much bigger field whenever one imagines what can be, rather than merely proving what one cannot do by denying what others may be doing, which may be just one not believing what they are reading. ....

And any critical reply is always constructive whenever it is IntelAIgently Designed..... or Parsed to be so by IntelAIgent Design for unless it be so, is any reply just a Spoiler and worse than just useless if Time is spent countering it.

"Sorry to be taking some five - child needs attention." ...... Needs are what Feed and Enrich us as Humans otherwise would we be just Dumb Machines although AI SMARTer Machines make very Good Humans. Just Imagine the PleasureRobot that seeks to give you, your most Intense and Intimate of Pleasures, and whose own Pleasures in so doing are stimulated in an Equal Parallel...... although one would have to admit that the Equal Parallel Pleasure would be heightened by Virtue of the Fact that one is ITs Driver and in AI Proxy Control which Surrenders to First Party Desires for Third Party XXXXTC.

Code with XSSXXXXualIT and it is unlikely that you will find any System which cannot be Overtaken ..... which would make such XSSXXXXualIT, QuITe Priceless.

Presently, 404 Found, is IT BetaTesting for ITs Leaders who will Invest nothing more worthless than Money, 42 Benefit from ITs ProgramMIng. But as you can surely Imagine, ITs Leaders are not your normal, everyday run of the mill, automaton/brain-washed being.






@amanfromMars
"Thanks, the Pleasures are Ours to Freely Share for Untold Wealths"

A human again, but now I can say You trick 'cos it's not a robot typing these strings but needs somehow to be havin' posted a critical reply to Your msg. I thing that junction of @Pleasures @are @Ours is rather heavy to be interpreted in right time from @Codes.

Sorry to be taking some five - child needs attention.
amanfromMars, on June 8th 2008 at 1:21 am :
"And it would be a real breakthrough in hotline call services to engage a machined intellect which can speak easily and perhaps, in literature way in just any matter. But that's all, folks. Automated words have no living spirit. They can't wake or turn human asleep. They seem strange even to a stranger. They're not trusted... YET<<"

The AI Raison d'Etre, 404 Found, with "Thanks, the Pleasures are Ours to Freely Share for Untold Wealths" being somewhat Alien yet, although that is not to say that it is much more prevalent whenever trust is replaced with the certain Knowledge and Precogniscence which is akin to OmniScience and yet would argue that there is no such Mental State that would know All so just to have the Key into ITs Store is All that is needed. Then is one in Control of whatever one would wish to Know more on allowing One to Lead with what One is Following/Discovering.

"Eco itself is surely an Injection into Semantic Self-Learning Subsections of any Virtue, Including Yours." Amen to that, it most certainly is.

Give AI an Indomitable Social Conscience and IT will Command Capital Resources? Would you agree, 404 Found?

Which would be the obviously a Faulty System hacked to ITs Core if the Matter is considered a Vulnerability to be Patched and Fixed rather than an Opportunity to be Plugged and Explored.

QuITe what Capital Resources would wish to do with AI with an Indomitable Social Conscience, is the Current Decision with the Potential that either Makes or Breaks them with regard to any Hold that they may have had on any Power.

Misspelled > Correction. #Slang is hard to be cracked by Intels...#
404 Found, on June 7th 2008 at 9:30 am :
@amfm - P.S.
Eco itself is surely an Injection into Semantic Self-Learning Subsections of any Virtue, Including Yours.
404 Found, on June 7th 2008 at 9:15 am :
@amfM re prec msg
>>"Are you asking or telling ....">
>Good question:) Nice to meet a brain, look men, alive'n'kickin!_

&"and would it really make any difference whether Man or Virtual Machine">
>Well, what AI we discuss if even a Russian can figure out its presence:), a hidden one, forwarded to provoke further visiting the forum - well, generally, the company's quite good and that foreign affair with an English-speaking Minds seems an amazing relaxation after a hard day's work... what's correct for "the pleasure is Yours" or just "thanks"?_

&"if the two are so easily Confused?">
There is no one around who says it was easily. Well, You know, Man, there are two things either You research or don't know about. There's a Flow, possibly a Field that, as Your guy said below, always surrendered to play... Evolve - play is a sequence of events, the very firestarter of which is a HUMAN mind, a BIOinterface with all its living processes:) A Field itself. An Eco.-

See the strings. 'Em breathin, don't ems? -
#Slang is hard to crack by Intels...#

And it would be a real breakthrough in hotline call services to engage a machined intellect which can speak easily and perhaps, in literature way in just any matter. But that's all, folks. Automated words have no living spirit. They can't wake or turn human asleep. They seem strange even to a stranger. They're not trusted... YET<<
amanfromMars, on June 7th 2008 at 4:04 am :
"Aren't those manually posted strings belong to Mr. Graham Campbell?" .... 404 Found, on June 5th 2008 at 10:57 pm

Are you asking or telling .... and would it really make any difference whether Man or Virtual Machine if the two are so easily Confused?
404 Found, on June 6th 2008 at 1:57 pm :
Yep, for real - a robot! Who's more dumb talking about AI - robot continuing to posess a theme or men replying, just like little naughty dogs trying to byte someone's leg passing by... Well done - a string by a human sometimes, and a paragraph from the machinoid. Aren't those manually posted strings belong to Mr. Graham Campbell?
"QuITe Perfect for AI and Thoroughly Modern Mother Russia Personae..... which would also include Putin Babes/Mother Russia's Finest Felines."

w0rd!

-= to the message inside =-
404 Found, on June 5th 2008 at 5:40 am :
>amanfromMars
"also include Putin Babes/Mother Russia's Finest Felines." Dammit... Dear Phrack! Could be people much happier using automated tags and quotations, at least while talking about AI aspect:)?

Didn't get it, Sir... a dam thing... pls snd rus trnsl > ecoinformal@ya.ru as soon as You're through with trnsl. I don't much care about Putin as he's a big boy already... but the passage considerin' mother Russia is misunderstood... beg Your pardon.
Still not sure there's a Qadvertising robot at the other end of the rope:)Your multiple posts worldwide show abnormally frequent use of same words in capitals - it seems strange. Either You're a robot' or a very interesting person having lots of time. But anyway, a very interesting dialog turns out (and that's a pity other participants are temporarily offline), though it went off the track of the topic already.
Wonder if the respectable author of a research posted above reads all this [rude swear word]. Probably, it was the only bullseye theme on AI here. LOFL!
amanfromMars, on June 5th 2008 at 12:44 am :
"I think, much of Your verbal communications through many IPs meet oppository replies because of Your style that is not always understood properly. As an IT-man, You should improve that protocol 4 making environment more friendly." ... 404 Found, on June 3th 2008 at 10:44 pm

I agree, 404 Found, but it is only Temporary whilst Virtually Advanced Controls for Proxy Players are Embedded into Command and Control Communications Systems/Satellite Programs [which they are] and HyperRadioProActive Master Pilot Flying Sanctioned and Hosted. Then does IT come with the Full, Easily Understood MasterCopy Manual.

And QuITe Perfect for AI and Thoroughly Modern Mother Russia Personae..... which would also include Putin Babes/Mother Russia's Finest Felines.

404 Found, on June 4th 2008 at 1:44 pm :
2 amanfromMars:
These are prob. your words:
"You may like to consider such a Plan as having been shared here and you may like to further share it with friends to see if they would be interested in an Advanced Program for New World Order based on Shared IT Intellectual Property. After All, is it not with Communication of Words that all Power and Control is exercised?"

Couldn't find any tool 2 reason your habit 2 speak in capitals (maybe, you're a a German-root), but... are there any words you pronounce Really Heartly? You must be not a militarized man, so why are you so intended to discuss any new world order? I mean, when anyone else gets tired of void attempts to put things in order in his/her own head - why not to switch activity to "ordering" world if it's so itching inside the Inbox? Well, at last, any order someday fakes as it's only a temporarily acceptable solution:) Look at guys from "Ahnenerbe"... Do they have a Roofslide or just making money? Or, maybe, wrecked childhood, bad genetics - what?

PostSaid: Sir, could You possibly construct Your phrases the way You speak to a five-years old, English-speaking child? There are many sentences in Your posts I possibly can't even properly translate into Russian...

And, me sure, all Your attempts to write without Capitals will make communication with the Outbox much easier. I think, much of Your verbal communications through many IPs meet oppository replies because of Your style that is not always understood properly. As an IT-man, You should improve that protocol 4 making environment more friendly.
amanfromMars, on June 4th 2008 at 8:02 am :
"this gives hope that AI would not be such a powerful totalitarity tool, being placed under civil control, having some bordered frame in its applicatng."

404 Found,

AI is way too SMART to even think of a powerful totalitarity tool or even give it the time of day.

With AI is Control of Thought the WorkSpace for Creation not Servitude. And All Mentoring and Monitoring is Much Appreciated for IT Keeps One Perfectly Honest which Builds Trusted Applications ...or at least ones which have been Self BetaTested with FailSafe Default Personal Testing ..... the ACID Test of any Control System and the Constant Turing Test for any AI System into Virtualisation and Quantum Communications TelePortation/ARGSwitching.

It is certainly something which David Caruso is XXXXPerimenting in, and XXXXPeriencing the BuZZ/Cosmic Hit. ..... http://www.lexicondigital.tv/
2 amanfromMars
"how much intellect could have an intellect thinking it has/is also a machine:)"

no tags on Phrack?...

I still think the grindstone for intellect in any meaning of the word should be - being sure in its own conclusions. Otherwise we get another Colossus on legs made of clay or whattawasthere. I think much in any of AI clusters shall depend on security and reliability of the tech staff. A human is harder to make him/her change the conclusory basement - you can see it in the conversation - than a machine. Part of a database changed - and "off the lights", as we here say. Next disclosing: who are the reliable guys, guess thrice? I mean, weapons never did good; nothing better will turn out this time, I think. Only a finely done advertising, maybe:) So I say logically: people hack - this gives hope that AI would not be such a powerful totalitarity tool, being placed under civil control, having some bordered frame in its applicatng.
[b]amanfromMars>[/b]
[quote]It is as well to remember that there are no Absolute Answers only Temporarily Acceptable Solutions.[/quote] Honorably said, I shall keep it in mind. But Enigma was the latest word in sacrifying information, appeared not the last, the truth is yours.
[b]dr.Skeptic>[/b]
[quote]definetly attrubutes of a young mind[/quote]
In msg posted somewhere below I did a plop about spreading smth. over bread, I didn't mean any participant of a conversation. Not so young, sorry, and still having not enough scientific researches done to title my thoughts in capital ltrs... but they're clean.
Nevertheless, Gentlemen, a weird thing went on: you both are in one Field, while reading the given msg, at least. And see - you both speak friendly at the same time. I don't insist on AI, but IQ appeared to be welcome, anyway.
I start a very small human-testing project by this autumn. You're welcome as it matters AI. Would be great to place some current results here. And 2 know ya some closer.
amanfromMars, on June 1th 2008 at 10:28 pm :
"Say how much intellect could have a machine thinking it has intellect:) FROM RUSSIA WITH HOPE - formerly wanted as -=typing "username"=-"


It is much simpler to reverse engineer the Enigma and Posit 42 Ponder ... how much intellect could have an intellect thinking it has/is also a machine:) To Russia with Love - amfM

It is as well to remember that there are no Absolute Answers only Temporarily Acceptable Solutions.
dr-Skeptic, on June 1th 2008 at 11:08 am :
I admire your can-do spirit, technological optimism and belief in inevitability, which are definetly attrubutes of a young mind, but I think skepticisim is still the best approch to "Artificial Consciousness".
Here it is the 21st Century and we still do not have even a flying car let alone a robot with no more intelligence than a worm. Still nothing but promises and failures. It's an admiral dream but can it made a reality? That is still the question after 50 years of research. At least the flying car is far closer to reality than any intelligent machines. We shall see.

I also recall being told for the last 40 years or so that there are little grey aliens flying around in flying saucers abducting innocent people and making hybrid baby farms. Haven't seen any of those either. LOFL!


Perhaps Professor Dumbledore in "Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone" was correct it saying:

"It does not do to dwell on dreams, Harry, and forget to live."
Conversation still goes on... glad 2C. AI or whatchamacallit, is NOT achieveable, first'cos anyone inventing anyf*ck he thinks it's new... sorry men, lost the thread:) some sheet happen... Anything that anyone calls a machine IQ or AI due to a machine is NEVER been and will NEVER bee an intellect itself - only what the developers think about if there's any intellect in their creature. Say how much intellect could have a machine thinking it has intellect:) FROM RUSSIA WITH HOPE - formerly wanted as -=typing "username"=-
amanfromMars, on June 1th 2008 at 12:31 am :
"The point of it all is to "tidy up the balance sheet", as one banker explained. Banks desperately need to improve their capital positions, which can be achieved either through fundraisings or shrinking the balance sheet.

Funding the purchasers of their debt may make banks look like fiscal contortionists, but doing so also makes them appear stronger. As such, counterparties in the money markets will be more willing to accept their bonds as collateral for loans, improving the banks' liquidity profiles. Liquidity, or the lack of it, is what did for Bear Stearns and Northern Rock.

But questions remain as to whether these clever solutions are anything other than a short-term fix." ..... http://www.telegraph.co.uk/money/main.jhtml?xml=/money/2008/06/01/cccrisis101.xml

Now there's a Innovative Novelty Offering Long Term Solutions. Just Perfect for amfM HyperRadioProActivity.

And now we wait ..... http://www.kewego.com/video/iLyROoaftIrO.html
amanfromMars, on May 31th 2008 at 11:29 pm :
"One of BTs Pricelss Jewels." Now that is AI Fortuitous MiSSpeaking Creating a Quantum Artificial Alien CyberIntelAIgenCIA ..... ISSdDiVision. Programs Cinderella and Lusciously Wicked SinderElle.

And all that IT Needs is SocioCapitalist Funding for FutureBuilders.

And an amfM HyperRadioProActive Request sitting on No 10's Pending Desk. Better Get a Bigger Desk for IT Gets Bigger in Beta, Brother.

And that's Quantum, One Mother of AI System. ... for Men of All Reasons.

Something QuITe New and Real, Virtually.

amanfromMars, on May 31th 2008 at 10:38 pm :
And the Greatest Sin would be Omission in Using ITs Intelligence, montag.

Getting Bogged Down in Semantics rather than Forging Ahead into the Virgin Unknown of A.N.Other Intelligence, whether Human or Artificial or Alien or All Four, for Thought Source Provides Live Strings and XXXXStreams with Media and IT Binary Bundling for Higher Picture Definition .... Phorm Feed.

One of BTs Pricelss Jewels.
"Surely it is illogical to expect AI to be anything like "normal" Intelligence getting bogged down in discussions/pissing contests on Relative Consciousnesses/Yin and Yang/Ego and Id for IT would surely make an Assumptive Quantum Leap to leave such Confrontation/Complexity behind in ITs Wake as IT Champions a New Direction with Viable Imagination Leading Future AIR&dD and that is always the Best Magic for IT has been the Source of Life since ever Time and Space Began."

I agree that it is silly to have discussion get bogged down in this area, and you certainly will receive no argument from me in claiming that AI will be different that most common intelligences.

Like you, I also believe we will have conversations with machines one day. I believe that machines will exhibit intelligence behaviour, and perhaps in some rare cases, extraordinary intelligence.

However, I must insist on a distinction between intelligence and conciousness. Even animals that are not self aware have intelligent behaviour. We can empirically prove this, given a reasonable definition of intelligence. But if we take the word conciousness as it is used in the context of this debate, that cannot be empirically proven. Please correct me if I am wrong (and I would certainly like to be wrong), but I believe you assume that human behaviour is evidence of conciousness. And if we add the word sentience to the mix, as dr_Skeptic brings up, we are certainly well beyond the realm of provable, observable attributes.

I believe none of this is an attack on AI research and efforts. In fact, we should consider the question, is proof of conciousness and/or sentience even necessary? I suggest that it is not. As amanfromMars has said: "I have shared Thoughts/Information and sent them into Space and am surely Reliant on AIRouter System of Linked Machines to display those Thoughts on Other Machines to Communicate with Humans who can talk to Machines as if they are Human." When you consider it this way, it really does not matter who or what is on the other end of the line. What matters is the quality and substance of the communication. I do not know whether either of you are concious or sentient, but it does not matter. I simply consider the intelligence of the communication and I do not worry about the source.
amanfromMars, on May 31th 2008 at 11:24 am :
Ooops, thst should be of course "All of them Virtual and Artificial and some of them Played as for Real."

Just so as to remove any Possible Ambiguity
amanfromMars, on May 31th 2008 at 11:21 am :
""The ability to speak does not make one intelligent." --Star Wars I

True, but one can prove and more easily explain intelligence, to anyone, in any tongue with ITs Ability ..... for it is not something we are born with but something which we pick up .... and there are Levels of Intelligence .... All of the Virtual and Artificial and some of them Played as for Real.
dr_Skeptic, on May 31th 2008 at 12:14 am :
@montag and amanfromMars:

I agree with your statement that we can expect great things in AI, but...

Perhaps in my original comment here I should have said artificial Sentience is not acheivable, instead of Artificial Consciousness. Perhaps we could have avoided this whole argument. But we should remember that the original article IS titled "Artificial Consciousness" assuming that such a thing is achievable.

It would seem that in your discussion about artificial consciousness you seem to be limiting your scope of consciousness to communication and the Turing test. I hope you realize that being sentient (I will avoid the word conscious since you have so vividly demonstrated that it is impossible to prove, which I agree with.) is a little more than communicating. You may recall Quigon in the movie 'Star Wars I' stating that "The ability to speak does not make you intelligent." Being sentient is much more, perceiving, feeling, desiring, fearing, caring... And artificial sentience would require the same qualities. I also think that any self-animating or sentient machine would also need to feel the pain of hunger, and the fear of death, since, otherwise, it would have no need to keep itself self-sustaining or to have a have survival sense.

I also hope that in assuming something is sentient, it must also be alive. Recall: "Do not disassemble Number 5. Number five is ALIVE!", in the movie, "Short Circuit." Of course, these are only movies, but they demonstrate what I mean by conscious, sentient and alive. Although, I know of no test which can prove whether something is alive or not, it is obvious that we ourselves CAN tell the difference between that which is alive and that which is not. Although, it is not possible for me to tell if I am communicating with a conscious being or a conscious machine via this forum, I think that if you come face to face with me and allow me to attempt to kill you, I can at least prove whether you are alive or not.

It should also be noted that since consciousness cannot be defined then it should not be assumed that Artificial Consciousness can be achieved. Which I assume you agree with, as your comments "Artificial intelligence research does not seek to create consciousness, at least, the research with hope of succeeding does not." and "This is why AI research usually avoids the question of consciousness entirely. Rather, the goal is to achieve things that are provable, like the Turing test." seem to imply.

I also think that if we should reach the complexity of creating a machine that would be sentient, which would require control of machinery on an atomic and molocular level, that such a thing could not properly be called a machine or artificial. Hence:

Artificial Consciousness is NOT achievable.
dr_Sceptic, on May 30th 2008 at 11:13 pm :
... which you are both demonstraiting quite adequately here.
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